Religion general
Cirrus Light 
Sciencepone of Science!
@Whatevs
As someone working on becoming an actual scientist, it bothers me sometimes when people say how much they ‘love’ science…
As someone working on becoming an actual scientist, it bothers me sometimes when people say how much they ‘love’ science…
Random-Rambling 
tinyurl.com/dymbb3a
@HJSDGCE
Basically, Scientology is basically the sort of “religion” P.T. Barnum would create if he was a conspiracy theorist.
“We all came from aliens! Find out the real truth by joining us and making a donation!”
This would be all well and good (live and let live, you know?)….if they didn’t engage in attacks, lawsuits, and heavy censorship of literally anything negative said about them. They’ve been doing this sort of aggressive silencing long before SJW-Tumblr was even a thing.
Basically, Scientology is basically the sort of “religion” P.T. Barnum would create if he was a conspiracy theorist.
“We all came from aliens! Find out the real truth by joining us and making a donation!”
This would be all well and good (live and let live, you know?)….if they didn’t engage in attacks, lawsuits, and heavy censorship of literally anything negative said about them. They’ve been doing this sort of aggressive silencing long before SJW-Tumblr was even a thing.
ЅℰℒᎯℙℋℐℰℒ 
Pomegranates :P
Get a load of this!
Russia ‘bans Scientology’ after Moscow court deems it ‘not a religion’
Russia ‘bans Scientology’ after Moscow court deems it ‘not a religion’
Scrabbleman 
[screams in German]
@SeraphimDawn
You can’t ban a religion!
Sure, you can make it unofficial but you can’t ban it! That’s the most insane thing one can do!
Religion has followers and banning it is just asking for trouble.
You can’t ban a religion!
Sure, you can make it unofficial but you can’t ban it! That’s the most insane thing one can do!
Religion has followers and banning it is just asking for trouble.
Icicle Niceicle 1517 
Ocs,Boops,Tickles&Memes
So, has anyone here been a atheist, and then joined a religion?
Random-Rambling
tinyurl.com/dymbb3a
@NileDawnheart
Hmm, I’ve heard of several people going from religious to atheist (usually due to a crisis of faith, dislike of the more strictly conservative parts, or just disillusionment with the concept of a higher power), but I’ve never heard of someone going from atheist to religious. If you don’t mid my asking, how did you come upon your religion?
Hmm, I’ve heard of several people going from religious to atheist (usually due to a crisis of faith, dislike of the more strictly conservative parts, or just disillusionment with the concept of a higher power), but I’ve never heard of someone going from atheist to religious. If you don’t mid my asking, how did you come upon your religion?
Icicle Niceicle 1517
Ocs,Boops,Tickles&Memes
@YetAnotherBrony
Don’t most atheists go religious when something bad happens? (Loss of someone close, recovery from addiction etc.
Don’t most atheists go religious when something bad happens? (Loss of someone close, recovery from addiction etc.
NileDawnheart
@YetAnotherBrony
When I did eventually start to think about serious things like death and my future, I was making a shift from strict atheism to agnosticism. I didn’t believe in a god, but I was opening up to the idea. As I grew (I’m only 20) I started to look at the doctrine of the main Christian denominations, and even briefly on Islam. Protestant faiths didn’t speak to me, because being at a Protestant church, I never felt like I was truly in the house of God. It felt like receiving a light beer when you are expecting a glass of whiskey. Catholicism was close enough to my faith, but I was never a big fan of the Pope, and the Orthodox faith sees the Pope and the Orthodox Patriarchs as equals. Catholicism is cool though. And Islam just never clicked with me, not because of a bad experience, but because I differ fairly from most Sunni teachings.
Orthodoxy though, I think was the best option for me. A church among equals with the Roman Catholic church. I agree with the Orthodox beliefs on many things like sin, salvation, divorce, the Holy Trinity, and the issue of monophysites vs. dyophysites (meaning monophysites believe Christ was only divine, and not also human). I believe he was both. The church has a long, and great history and nearly everything practiced in the church today, would be the same as it was back in the days of Nicaea and before. You feel as if you’re in Heaven on earth, with beautiful icons and/or frescoes decorating the walls, the incense, and even the lovely hymns in either Greek, Slavonic, Arabic, or any other language the church practices.
It’s hard to put into words, but basically it spoke to me more than a lack of a belief. My life feels oddly enriched when I have someone to turn to when I am in need of it. I’ve had long talks with God and he has shown me nothing but love, and things have been going much better in life as well. I feel happier, am motivated, and still dedicate my short time on this planet to being a good son for when my time comes, to please Christ and all around him.
I’m sort of rambling, but like I said, hard to really put into words.
When I did eventually start to think about serious things like death and my future, I was making a shift from strict atheism to agnosticism. I didn’t believe in a god, but I was opening up to the idea. As I grew (I’m only 20) I started to look at the doctrine of the main Christian denominations, and even briefly on Islam. Protestant faiths didn’t speak to me, because being at a Protestant church, I never felt like I was truly in the house of God. It felt like receiving a light beer when you are expecting a glass of whiskey. Catholicism was close enough to my faith, but I was never a big fan of the Pope, and the Orthodox faith sees the Pope and the Orthodox Patriarchs as equals. Catholicism is cool though. And Islam just never clicked with me, not because of a bad experience, but because I differ fairly from most Sunni teachings.
Orthodoxy though, I think was the best option for me. A church among equals with the Roman Catholic church. I agree with the Orthodox beliefs on many things like sin, salvation, divorce, the Holy Trinity, and the issue of monophysites vs. dyophysites (meaning monophysites believe Christ was only divine, and not also human). I believe he was both. The church has a long, and great history and nearly everything practiced in the church today, would be the same as it was back in the days of Nicaea and before. You feel as if you’re in Heaven on earth, with beautiful icons and/or frescoes decorating the walls, the incense, and even the lovely hymns in either Greek, Slavonic, Arabic, or any other language the church practices.
It’s hard to put into words, but basically it spoke to me more than a lack of a belief. My life feels oddly enriched when I have someone to turn to when I am in need of it. I’ve had long talks with God and he has shown me nothing but love, and things have been going much better in life as well. I feel happier, am motivated, and still dedicate my short time on this planet to being a good son for when my time comes, to please Christ and all around him.
I’m sort of rambling, but like I said, hard to really put into words.
Kazapsky 
If you live in Hollywood’s universe, maybe.
Five scoops of ice cream
@YetAnotherBrony
Don’t most atheists go religious when something bad happens? (Loss of someone close, recovery from addiction etc.
If you live in Hollywood’s universe, maybe.
Scrabbleman
[screams in German]
People need something to believe in.
Religion is that path.
It’s just that people keep abusing and creating “the word of God” and shit just to fill in their selfish wants and needs.
Religion is that path.
It’s just that people keep abusing and creating “the word of God” and shit just to fill in their selfish wants and needs.
Random-Rambling
tinyurl.com/dymbb3a
@HJSDGCE
Agreed! With some of these people, you’d think there was some divine quota of people one has to convert before they’re allowed into heaven.
If I was them, I’d be like “You’re not going to follow my religion? Fine, no skin off my nose.”
Agreed! With some of these people, you’d think there was some divine quota of people one has to convert before they’re allowed into heaven.
If I was them, I’d be like “You’re not going to follow my religion? Fine, no skin off my nose.”
Zincy
In Vino Veritas
@YetAnotherBrony
Technically, they sort of do. The evangelicals believe they’re called upon/ordered to proselytize and spread the faith.
Technically, they sort of do. The evangelicals believe they’re called upon/ordered to proselytize and spread the faith.
Scrabbleman
[screams in German]
@Zincy
Well that’s dumb. The evangelicals, I mean.
To me, spreading religion means so that people know of its existence, not as a way to extend your belief.
It’s like history. You teach people history so that they know of it from the success and falls of civilisation and maybe learn of it. You don’t teach history so that people repeat it.
Well that’s dumb. The evangelicals, I mean.
To me, spreading religion means so that people know of its existence, not as a way to extend your belief.
It’s like history. You teach people history so that they know of it from the success and falls of civilisation and maybe learn of it. You don’t teach history so that people repeat it.
Random-Rambling
tinyurl.com/dymbb3a
@HJSDGCE
The people who spread religion should be doing it out of a belief that it will make your life (and/or afterlife) better, not because it gives the spreader’s religion more power/influence/territory.
Unfortunately, people are naturally a bit selfish and greedy, so it’s usually the latter reason than the former reason.
Saying that I’ll burn in hell forever if I don’t join up isn’t much of a motivator.
The people who spread religion should be doing it out of a belief that it will make your life (and/or afterlife) better, not because it gives the spreader’s religion more power/influence/territory.
Unfortunately, people are naturally a bit selfish and greedy, so it’s usually the latter reason than the former reason.
Saying that I’ll burn in hell forever if I don’t join up isn’t much of a motivator.
Cirrus Light
C.S. Lewis is actually an example of a rather high-profile figure who went from atheist to believing.
Personally, I wonder if I were born to atheist parents of I wouldn’t be agnostic just on the principles of metaphysics.
Reality is an odd, odd thing… I have a hard time buying the materialist philosophy. I mean, yes, it offers some comfort in assuming that everything is knowable, that eventually everything can be boiled down to physics - but the mind-body problem is just too much for me to accept as a simple; “qualia is an illusion.” I think that’s just hogwash: “I think, therefore I am,” makes it quite clear, at least to me, that my own consciousness is the first and foremost thing to exist - my senses can be lied to, and always are when I dream, therefore they’re less reliable than my own qualia existence. So if my senses fail to detect anything that indicates my qualia exists, then it must simply be that my senses are incapable of detecting it, because I’m sure I’m not a P-zombie. Therefore, if qualia is a real thing that exists, the mind-body problem would seem to imply that there’s more to reality than the physical plane. Or at least, that qualia must be some sort of fundamental particle… But that’s a discussion for another time.
Suffice it to say, I think I’d be what people generally call “agnostic,” though strictly speaking, I’m an “agnostic theist” - as most Mormons actually are, but because the term “agnostic” so widely misunderstood they wouldn’t identify as such.
(It’s kinda funny - the culturally Mormon idea of “faith” or “belief” is simply a quantitative lesser degree of “knowledge,” ie, knowledge with uncertainty. I didn’t even know that “faith” and “belief” were qualitatively different in the gnostic sense until religion classes at college)
Anyways, I love to try to derive things from first principles, but this is a long problem that would take a long time to build up from the ground up - discovering God purely through philosophy - so I’m rather glad we don’t have to. As Einstein put it,
Citation: Viereck, George Sylvester. “Glimpses of the Great”. Duckworth, 1930. p. 372-373
To which I would respond; “It’s a good thing we don’t have to discover God by reading those books - instead He comes to us.”
@NileDawnheart
I dunno if I’ve asked this before, but have you looked into Mormonism?
…What? He mentioned investigating a lot of different things, so if someone is searching for something, and you think you’ve found it, why not mention that?
Why not both?
If you thought you knew how to build a utopia, you’d probably want to start building it, too. Granted, Utopia is really about the people rather than any system of law - it’s a cultural thing, and no matter how hard you try to push ideals, it really comes down to every member of society to make it a good one.
But the second one can build into the first one, and vice versa. But I do agree, though, that the first is definitely the best primary motivator.
Sciencepone of Science!
Hmm, I’ve heard of several people going from religious to atheist (usually due to a crisis of faith, dislike of the more strictly conservative parts, or just disillusionment with the concept of a higher power), but I’ve never heard of someone going from atheist to religious. If you don’t mid my asking, how did you come upon your religion?
C.S. Lewis is actually an example of a rather high-profile figure who went from atheist to believing.
Personally, I wonder if I were born to atheist parents of I wouldn’t be agnostic just on the principles of metaphysics.
Reality is an odd, odd thing… I have a hard time buying the materialist philosophy. I mean, yes, it offers some comfort in assuming that everything is knowable, that eventually everything can be boiled down to physics - but the mind-body problem is just too much for me to accept as a simple; “qualia is an illusion.” I think that’s just hogwash: “I think, therefore I am,” makes it quite clear, at least to me, that my own consciousness is the first and foremost thing to exist - my senses can be lied to, and always are when I dream, therefore they’re less reliable than my own qualia existence. So if my senses fail to detect anything that indicates my qualia exists, then it must simply be that my senses are incapable of detecting it, because I’m sure I’m not a P-zombie. Therefore, if qualia is a real thing that exists, the mind-body problem would seem to imply that there’s more to reality than the physical plane. Or at least, that qualia must be some sort of fundamental particle… But that’s a discussion for another time.
Suffice it to say, I think I’d be what people generally call “agnostic,” though strictly speaking, I’m an “agnostic theist” - as most Mormons actually are, but because the term “agnostic” so widely misunderstood they wouldn’t identify as such.
(It’s kinda funny - the culturally Mormon idea of “faith” or “belief” is simply a quantitative lesser degree of “knowledge,” ie, knowledge with uncertainty. I didn’t even know that “faith” and “belief” were qualitatively different in the gnostic sense until religion classes at college)
Anyways, I love to try to derive things from first principles, but this is a long problem that would take a long time to build up from the ground up - discovering God purely through philosophy - so I’m rather glad we don’t have to. As Einstein put it,
Your question is the most difficult in the world. It is not a question I can answer simply with yes or no. I am not an Atheist. I do not know if I can define myself as a Pantheist. The problem involved is too vast for our limited minds. May I not reply with a parable? The human mind, no matter how highly trained, cannot grasp the universe. We are in the position of a little child, entering a huge library whose walls are covered to the ceiling with books in many different tongues. The child knows that someone must have written those books. It does not know who or how. It does not understand the languages in which they are written. The child notes a definite plan in the arrangement of the books, a mysterious order, which it does not comprehend, but only dimly suspects. That, it seems to me, is the attitude of the human mind, even the greatest and most cultured, toward God. We see a universe marvelously arranged, obeying certain laws, but we understand the laws only dimly. Our limited minds cannot grasp the mysterious force that sways the constellations. I am fascinated by Spinoza’s Pantheism. I admire even more his contributions to modern thought. Spinoza is the greatest of modern philosophers, because he is the first philosopher who deals with the soul and the body as one, not as two separate things.
Citation: Viereck, George Sylvester. “Glimpses of the Great”. Duckworth, 1930. p. 372-373
To which I would respond; “It’s a good thing we don’t have to discover God by reading those books - instead He comes to us.”
@NileDawnheart
I dunno if I’ve asked this before, but have you looked into Mormonism?
…What? He mentioned investigating a lot of different things, so if someone is searching for something, and you think you’ve found it, why not mention that?
The people who spread religion should be doing it out of a belief that it will make your life (and/or afterlife) better, not because it gives the spreader’s religion more power/influence/territory.Unfortunately, people are naturally a bit selfish and greedy, so it’s usually the latter reason than the former reason.Saying that I’ll burn in hell forever if I don’t join up isn’t much of a motivator.
Why not both?
If you thought you knew how to build a utopia, you’d probably want to start building it, too. Granted, Utopia is really about the people rather than any system of law - it’s a cultural thing, and no matter how hard you try to push ideals, it really comes down to every member of society to make it a good one.
But the second one can build into the first one, and vice versa. But I do agree, though, that the first is definitely the best primary motivator.
Zincy
In Vino Veritas
@Cirrus Light
Those who attempt to build a utopia have often instead built hell on earth. Imposed perfection is doomed to fail, as (and I’m sure this will make Whatevs chuckle at my expense) humans are too different to ever be under one, singular ideology.
Those who attempt to build a utopia have often instead built hell on earth. Imposed perfection is doomed to fail, as (and I’m sure this will make Whatevs chuckle at my expense) humans are too different to ever be under one, singular ideology.
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